Posted by Larry Joseph on December 22, 1998 at 18:55:38:
In Reply to: Re: Negative image posted by James Allen on December 22, 1998 at 15:39:13:
: : Ghenghis Khan never got further than the Krimea. His successors of the Golden Horde got as far as present day Hungary, but never anyplace near Rome.
: : Regards, Yon
: Subadai and another great general sent troops almost to Rome. I spoke as if the Khan himself was in the vanguard but of course he was not. Hungary was where some big battles took place and Turkoman articles were undoubtedly lost, see Ghereh paper. You mention nothing of his eastward thrust, you admit then it was to present day Korea. The fact is Ghenghis Khan sent a letter to St. Louis of France telling him what a city dwelling swine he was and had the Pope offering him the Vatican treasures if he wouldn't sack Rome. The Devils Horsemen by Chambers is excellent reading. JIM
Jim, I believe that you are incorrectly asserting that Turkoman horseman traveled to the "outskirts to Rome". None of the sources I could find collaborate this assertion. The following passage is typical of what I could find:
"...the Mongols did not remain long in Hungary...On December 11, 1241, Ogadei died in Asia. Upon learning of the great khan's death, Subotai reminded the three princes in his army of the law of succession as laid down by Genghis Khan: "After the death of the ruler all offspring of the house of Genghis Khan, wherever they might be, must return to Mongolia to take part in the election of the new khakan." Recalling all their forces, the Mongols started back to their Mongolian capital of Karakorum, postponing their invasion of central Europe for another time--a time that would never come."
There is no written records I could find (and as I understand it, there were plenty of people in Europe keeping written records at that time) of any mongol armies going any further into Europe than Hungary.
As to the other two points (that Khan made it to Korea, and that he threatened the pope by letter), they are irrelevant as support for your original (incorrect) assertion.
To paraphrase my freshman English teacher: "It is beneficial to treat your facts with imagination, but to imagine your facts, well that is quite another matter."
Regards,
Larry