Ensi were door curtain

Rich Larkin · March 20th, 2018, 05:49 PM

Hi Martin,

I was joking about the staged photo shoot and the Madison Avenue (New York, where the advertising industry is thought to have reached the stars...!) approach implemented by the Tekke marketing geniuses. Maybe it was mini-staged, where Prokudin-Gorsky

Speaking of geniuses, I am thoroughly impressed with your collection of ensis that mimic the one in the photo. You are definitely my favorite speculator on any subject!

Rich

Martin Andersen · March 20th, 2018, 06:37 PM

Your right Steve, even 2 feet is a steep step, and not practical for a quick entre. But the Germech must anyway to some extend have been seen as an intended semi-barrier, kind of a half open/ half closed door. Again I would think it wasn't for everyday use, as with many of the Turkmen weaves a relation to the marriage ceremonies to me seems plausible (perhaps something like "please don't disturb the newly wed too much"

)

Come to think about it, and looking through the Germechs I have in my photo archive, the few which have fringes or reminiscence of fringes seem to have fringes made simply by the warp threads, like this late Ersari Germech:

Warp fringes to me ain't terrible decorative, and aren’t the long and decorative fringes on fx Tekke pieces always colored, and applied into the warp and weft at the end of the pile weave? Like here:

I don’t think I have seen long decorative colored fringes applied at the end of flat weave endings. The Tekke Germechs doesn’t have any traces of colored “fringe-knots” where the pile weave is ending:

And on the other hand the specific design requirement of the Germech is as far as I understand that it mimics elements of the lover part of Ensis elem (and its borders) - and Ensis don’t have long decorative fringes at the elem. So perhaps long decorative fringes is actually not a regular design element of a Germech, and the one posted earlier an odd duck? (Turkmens breaking the rules seem to be a rule)

Sorry if I am hijacking the thread to be about the Germech format instead of the Ensi, but I of course sees them as being an interesting pair.

best
Martin
(and thanks Rich, i will try to come up with something more wild than this

)

Steve Price · March 20th, 2018, 07:57 PM

Hi Martin

The fringes on the germetches you posted look like extensions of the warps, as are most of the fringes I've seen on Turkmen weavings. Sewn on fringes seem to be uncommon in Turkmen work.

You point out that they probably weren't in place except on special occasions, when so the barrier they present wouldn't be an everyday obstacle. That was pointed out to me at the time I wrote the letter to HALI, too, and has merit. On the other hand, unless the yurt has indoor plumbing, it would be necessary to cross the threshold from time to time even on special occasions.

If any 19th century travelers mentioned the germetsch it would make understanding its function much easier. My gut feeling is that a long fringe that barely reaches the floor is an unlikely decorative or functional element, so I'm inclined to think it was a trapping for the interior of the yurt or for some animal. But it's hard to be confident in that belief.

Steve Price

Chuck Wagner · March 20th, 2018, 08:11 PM

Hi

Most of the older yurt images show a wood threshold board that is at least 12 inches high at the bottom of the entryways. If the flatwoven portion was on the ground, then it's conceivable as an exterior cover. I am inclined to believe that it may have been used on the backside of the board, as a more pleasant - and insulating - interior facing cover.

Regards
Chuck

Martin Andersen · March 21st, 2018, 06:16 AM

hmm Steve

my terminology might be wrong but I am fairly certain that most long decorative colored fringes on Turkmen pieces are woven/applied into the warp and weft. On fx Torbas and Chuvals ect. the warp continues beyond the “fringes-knots” and becomes the uncolored plain weave of the bags back.

I have a few pieces with long fringes and a lot of pieces with reminisces of the large “fringe-knots”, placed in the transition between the pile and plain weave like this:

From what I can see on photos something like this also goes for Khalyks and other Turkmen trappings (though they of course don't have a plain weave back), thats is to say the fringes are inserted as "uncut large fringe-knots" where the pile weave ends.

best
Martin

Steve Price · March 21st, 2018, 12:13 PM

Hi Martin

You're right, I was having a senior moment. The fringes are essentially a row of very long pile. It's neither sewn on nor is it extended warp.

I think I'm lucid again. My apologies.

Steve Price

Martin Andersen · March 21st, 2018, 03:12 PM

Totally okay Steve, I sure know the felling

I hadn’t thought about this before you brought it up here, but looking closer into the fringes regarding the Germechs is totally relevant and interesting:

In my photo archive I have a total of 22 possible Germechs.

16 of these still have the lower end flat weave (or reminiscenses of it) - and none of these 16 have any large colored "fringe knots"! That is rather extraordinary.
(There is the one odd duck, posted earlier with the long warp fringes, it also have borders which differs from the rest)

So at least concerning the Germechs I have seen this means one could argue that they as a format are peculiar in this, and differs from other bags and trappings in that they don’t have the large colored fringe-knots in the transition between pile weave and flat weave. This as far as I can see means that they actually never had long colored decorative fringes, as opposed to other trappings and bags - perhaps exactly because they were intended to hang low. I know it's a rather convoluted argument, but I dont think it’s far out.

Perhaps the lack of "fringe knots" in conjunction with size/design from the Ensis elem/ Ensi borders/and upper reenforcement is the definition of the Germech format? Well, I will keep on looking to see if this holds water, I of course as often before may be wrong.

Here a slightly better scan of the grand old lady of the Germech format from Jürg Rageth’s book, size 79x33 cm :

best Martin

Martin Andersen · March 22nd, 2018, 07:32 AM

Hi All

The photografer Paul Nadar was in Turkmenistan 1890 and he also took a few photos of Tekke (? not quite sure, but he was in Merv) yurts where there is no doubt door rugs are used, not filt or wooden doors. The door rugs here ain’t Ensis, i suppose it looks more like a flat weave type, unfortunately i don’t have the photos in higher resolution:

These yurts doesn't have the heavy wooden door frame and wooden doorstep of the later yurts on Prokudin-Gorsky's photos. In one of the yurts there is hanging a cord across the lower part of the doorway, perhaps functioning as a semi-barrier like a Germech would have, or perhaps it could even have carried a textile if tighten up:

I suppose that in 1890, ca 10 years after the final Russian annexation of Turkmenistan all the finer rugs are already either exported to Skt. Petersborg or on their way. No doubt that the Turkmen in 1890 were poor and on their way to losing their weaving tradition.
I think something like this is plausible: The Turkmens after their defeat being forced to a more sedentary lifestile, cheap building materials including wood coming in from north, making the wooden yurt door more common and perhaps even fashionable and desirable among the Turkmens, and the old rugs disappearing, including Ensis and Germechs.

Paul Nadar also have a few fine photos of how carpet dealing happened directly along the railway track:

best
Martin

Steve Price · March 22nd, 2018, 11:38 AM

Hi Martin

Nice find. One thing I'm struck by is how much taller than the doorways the people are. It surprised me - my thinking has been that most Asians were of short stature until after WW-II (the Japanese were, for sure).

Steve Price

Martin Andersen · March 22nd, 2018, 12:03 PM

yes Steve you are right, they are proportionally tall, no way for man running quickly inside with a Telkep on top

Steve Price · March 22nd, 2018, 02:09 PM

They must have been really good at bending over.

Steve Price

Rich Larkin · March 22nd, 2018, 02:30 PM

Great pics, Martin. The second one seems to have a similar entrance covering textile to the first one, but thrown up on the roof in that case. It isn't familiar to me. Perhaps that was the daily item, and the ensi/germetch arangement was for special occasions, as you suggested.

As to the height of the Tekke, we must keep in mind they were Turkic people, in contrast to many other Asian groups who might on average be shorter people.

March 20th, 2018, 06:37 PM	#2
Martin Andersen Members Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 121	Your right Steve, even 2 feet is a steep step, and not practical for a quick entre. But the Germech must anyway to some extend have been seen as an intended semi-barrier, kind of a half open/ half closed door. Again I would think it wasn't for everyday use, as with many of the Turkmen weaves a relation to the marriage ceremonies to me seems plausible (perhaps something like "please don't disturb the newly wed too much") Come to think about it, and looking through the Germechs I have in my photo archive, the few which have fringes or reminiscence of fringes seem to have fringes made simply by the warp threads, like this late Ersari Germech: Warp fringes to me ain't terrible decorative, and aren’t the long and decorative fringes on fx Tekke pieces always colored, and applied into the warp and weft at the end of the pile weave? Like here: I don’t think I have seen long decorative colored fringes applied at the end of flat weave endings. The Tekke Germechs doesn’t have any traces of colored “fringe-knots” where the pile weave is ending: And on the other hand the specific design requirement of the Germech is as far as I understand that it mimics elements of the lover part of Ensis elem (and its borders) - and Ensis don’t have long decorative fringes at the elem. So perhaps long decorative fringes is actually not a regular design element of a Germech, and the one posted earlier an odd duck? (Turkmens breaking the rules seem to be a rule) Sorry if I am hijacking the thread to be about the Germech format instead of the Ensi, but I of course sees them as being an interesting pair. best Martin (and thanks Rich, i will try to come up with something more wild than this) Last edited by Martin Andersen; March 20th, 2018 at 07:11 PM.

March 21st, 2018, 03:12 PM	#7
Martin Andersen Members Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 121	Totally okay Steve, I sure know the felling I hadn’t thought about this before you brought it up here, but looking closer into the fringes regarding the Germechs is totally relevant and interesting: In my photo archive I have a total of 22 possible Germechs. 16 of these still have the lower end flat weave (or reminiscenses of it) - and none of these 16 have any large colored "fringe knots"! That is rather extraordinary. (There is the one odd duck, posted earlier with the long warp fringes, it also have borders which differs from the rest) So at least concerning the Germechs I have seen this means one could argue that they as a format are peculiar in this, and differs from other bags and trappings in that they don’t have the large colored fringe-knots in the transition between pile weave and flat weave. This as far as I can see means that they actually never had long colored decorative fringes, as opposed to other trappings and bags - perhaps exactly because they were intended to hang low. I know it's a rather convoluted argument, but I dont think it’s far out. Perhaps the lack of "fringe knots" in conjunction with size/design from the Ensis elem/ Ensi borders/and upper reenforcement is the definition of the Germech format? Well, I will keep on looking to see if this holds water, I of course as often before may be wrong. Here a slightly better scan of the grand old lady of the Germech format from Jürg Rageth’s book, size 79x33 cm : best Martin Last edited by Martin Andersen; March 21st, 2018 at 03:47 PM.

March 22nd, 2018, 07:32 AM	#8
Martin Andersen Members Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 121	Hi All The photografer Paul Nadar was in Turkmenistan 1890 and he also took a few photos of Tekke (? not quite sure, but he was in Merv) yurts where there is no doubt door rugs are used, not filt or wooden doors. The door rugs here ain’t Ensis, i suppose it looks more like a flat weave type, unfortunately i don’t have the photos in higher resolution: These yurts doesn't have the heavy wooden door frame and wooden doorstep of the later yurts on Prokudin-Gorsky's photos. In one of the yurts there is hanging a cord across the lower part of the doorway, perhaps functioning as a semi-barrier like a Germech would have, or perhaps it could even have carried a textile if tighten up: I suppose that in 1890, ca 10 years after the final Russian annexation of Turkmenistan all the finer rugs are already either exported to Skt. Petersborg or on their way. No doubt that the Turkmen in 1890 were poor and on their way to losing their weaving tradition. I think something like this is plausible: The Turkmens after their defeat being forced to a more sedentary lifestile, cheap building materials including wood coming in from north, making the wooden yurt door more common and perhaps even fashionable and desirable among the Turkmens, and the old rugs disappearing, including Ensis and Germechs. Paul Nadar also have a few fine photos of how carpet dealing happened directly along the railway track: best Martin Last edited by Martin Andersen; March 22nd, 2018 at 09:14 AM. Reason: (sorry for my broken english, as times goes even my danish is becoming broken)

March 20th, 2018, 05:49 PM	#1
Rich Larkin Members Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 130	Hi Martin, I was joking about the staged photo shoot and the Madison Avenue (New York, where the advertising industry is thought to have reached the stars...!) approach implemented by the Tekke marketing geniuses. Maybe it was mini-staged, where Prokudin-Gorsky Speaking of geniuses, I am thoroughly impressed with your collection of ensis that mimic the one in the photo. You are definitely my favorite speculator on any subject! Rich

March 20th, 2018, 07:57 PM	#3
Steve Price Administrator Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 121	Hi Martin The fringes on the germetches you posted look like extensions of the warps, as are most of the fringes I've seen on Turkmen weavings. Sewn on fringes seem to be uncommon in Turkmen work. You point out that they probably weren't in place except on special occasions, when so the barrier they present wouldn't be an everyday obstacle. That was pointed out to me at the time I wrote the letter to HALI, too, and has merit. On the other hand, unless the yurt has indoor plumbing, it would be necessary to cross the threshold from time to time even on special occasions. If any 19th century travelers mentioned the germetsch it would make understanding its function much easier. My gut feeling is that a long fringe that barely reaches the floor is an unlikely decorative or functional element, so I'm inclined to think it was a trapping for the interior of the yurt or for some animal. But it's hard to be confident in that belief. Steve Price

March 20th, 2018, 08:11 PM	#4
Chuck Wagner Administrator Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 163	Hi Most of the older yurt images show a wood threshold board that is at least 12 inches high at the bottom of the entryways. If the flatwoven portion was on the ground, then it's conceivable as an exterior cover. I am inclined to believe that it may have been used on the backside of the board, as a more pleasant - and insulating - interior facing cover. Regards Chuck

March 21st, 2018, 06:16 AM	#5
Martin Andersen Members Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 121	hmm Steve my terminology might be wrong but I am fairly certain that most long decorative colored fringes on Turkmen pieces are woven/applied into the warp and weft. On fx Torbas and Chuvals ect. the warp continues beyond the “fringes-knots” and becomes the uncolored plain weave of the bags back. I have a few pieces with long fringes and a lot of pieces with reminisces of the large “fringe-knots”, placed in the transition between the pile and plain weave like this: From what I can see on photos something like this also goes for Khalyks and other Turkmen trappings (though they of course don't have a plain weave back), thats is to say the fringes are inserted as "uncut large fringe-knots" where the pile weave ends. best Martin

March 21st, 2018, 12:13 PM	#6
Steve Price Administrator Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 121	Hi Martin You're right, I was having a senior moment. The fringes are essentially a row of very long pile. It's neither sewn on nor is it extended warp. I think I'm lucid again. My apologies. Steve Price

March 22nd, 2018, 11:38 AM	#9
Steve Price Administrator Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 121	Hi Martin Nice find. One thing I'm struck by is how much taller than the doorways the people are. It surprised me - my thinking has been that most Asians were of short stature until after WW-II (the Japanese were, for sure). Steve Price

March 22nd, 2018, 12:03 PM	#10
Martin Andersen Members Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 121	yes Steve you are right, they are proportionally tall, no way for man running quickly inside with a Telkep on top

March 22nd, 2018, 02:09 PM	#11
Steve Price Administrator Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 121	They must have been really good at bending over. Steve Price

March 22nd, 2018, 02:30 PM	#12
Rich Larkin Members Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 130	Great pics, Martin. The second one seems to have a similar entrance covering textile to the first one, but thrown up on the roof in that case. It isn't familiar to me. Perhaps that was the daily item, and the ensi/germetch arangement was for special occasions, as you suggested. As to the height of the Tekke, we must keep in mind they were Turkic people, in contrast to many other Asian groups who might on average be shorter people.